Why is Linux so frustrating for some people?

Don’t get me wrong. I love Linux and FOSS. I have been using and installing distros on my own since I was 12. Now that I’m working in tech-related positions, after the Reddit migration happened, etc. I recovered my interest in all the Linux environment. I use Ubuntu as my main operating system in my Desktop, but I always end up feeling very limited. There’s always software I can’t use properly (and not just Windows stuff), some stuff badly configured with weird error messages… last time I was not able to even use the apt command. Sometimes I lack time and energy for troubleshooting and sometimes I just fail at it.

I usually end up in need of redoing a fresh install until it breaks up again. Maybe Linux is not good for beginners working full time? Maybe we should do something like that Cisco course that teaches you the basic commands?

kyub , (edited )
  1. False promises early on

We desktop Linux users are partly to blame for this. In ~1998 there was massive hype and media attention towards Linux being this viable alternative to Windows on the desktop. A lot of magazines and websites claimed that. Well, in 1998 I can safely say that Linux could be seen as an alternative, but not a mainstream compatible one. 25 years later, it’s much easier to argue that it is, because it truly is easy to use nowadays, but back then, it certainly wasn’t yet. The sad thing is, that we Linux users kind of caused a lot of people to think negatively about desktop Linux, just because we tried pushing them towards it too early on. A common problem in tech I think, where tech which isn’t quite ready yet is being hyped as ready. Which leads to the second point:

  1. FUD / lack of information / lack of access to good, up to date information

People see low adoption rates, hear about “problems” or think it’s a “toy for nerds”, or still have an outdated view on desktop Linux. These things stick, and probably also cause people to think "oh yeah I’ve heard about that, it’s probably nothing for me"

  1. Preinstallations / OEM partnerships

MS has a huge advantage here, and a lot of the like really casual ordinary users out there will just use whatever comes preinstalled on their devices, which is in almost 100% of all cases Windows.

  1. Schools / education

They still sometimes or even often(?) teach MS product usage, to “better prepare the students for their later work life where they almost certainly use ‘industry standard’ software like MS Office”. This gets them used to the combo MS Windows+Office at an early age. A massive problem, and a huge failure of the education system to not be neutral in that regard.

  1. Hardware and software devs ALWAYS ensure that their stuff is compatible with Windows due to its market share, but don’t often ensure this for Linux, and whether 3rd party drivers are 100% feature complete or even working at all, is not sure

So you still need to be a bit careful about what you use (hardware & software) on Linux, while for Windows it’s pretty much “turn your brain off, pick anything, it’ll work”. Just a problem of adoption rate though, as Linux grew, its compatibility grew as well, so this problem decreased by a lot already, but of course until everything will also automatically work on Linux, and until most devs will port their stuff to Linux as well as Windows and OS X, it will still need even more market share for desktop Linux. Since this is a known chicken-egg-effect (Linux has low adoption because software isn’t available, but for software to become available, Linux marketshare needs to grow), we need to do it anyway, just to get out of that “dilemma”. Just like Valve did when they said one day “ok f*ck this, we might have problems for our main business model when Microsoft becomes a direct competitor to Steam, so we must push towards neutral technologies, which is Linux”. And then they did, and it worked out well for them, and the Linux community as a whole benefited from this due to having more choice now on which platforms their stuff can run. Even if we’re talking about a proprietary application here, it’s still a big milestone when you can run so many more applications/games suddenly on Linux, than before, and it drives adoption rates higher as well. So there you have a company who just did it, despite market share dictating that they shouldn’t have done that. More companies need to follow, because that will also automatically increase desktop Linux marketshare, and this is all inter-connected. More marketshare, more devs, more compatibility, more apps available, and so on. Just start doing it, goddamnit. Staying on Windows means supporting the status quo and not helping to make any positive progress.

  1. Either the general public needs to become more familiar with CLI usage (I’d prefer that), or Linux desktop applications need to become more feature-complete so that almost everything a regular user needs can be done via GUI as well

This is still not the case yet, but it’s gotten better. Generally speaking: If you’re afraid of the CLI, Linux is not something for you probably. But you shouldn’t be afraid of it. You also aren’t afraid of chat prompts. Most commands are easy to understand.

  1. The amount of choice the user is confronted with (multiple distros, desktop environments, and so on) can lead to option paralysis

So people think they either have to research each option (extra effort required), or are likely to “choose wrong”, and then don’t choose at all. This is just an education issue though. People need to realize that this choice isn’t bad, but actually good, and a consequence of an open environment where multiple projects “compete” for the same spot. Often, there are only a few viable options anyway. So it’s not like you have to check out a lot. But we have to make sure that potential new users know which options are a great starting point for them, and not have them get lost in researching some niche distros/projects which they shouldn’t start out with generally.

  1. “Convenience is a drug”

Which means a lot of people, even smart ones, will not care about any negatives as long as the stuff they’re using works without any perceived user-relevant issues. Which means: they’ll continue to use Windows even after it comes bundled with spyware, because they value the stuff “working” more than things like user control/agency, privacy, security and other more abstract things. This is problematic, because they position themselves in an absolute dependency where they can’t get out of anymore and where all sorts of data about their work, private life, behavior, and so on is being leaked to external 3rd parties. This also presents a high barrier of convincing them to start becoming more technically independent: why should they make an effort to switch away from something that works in their eyes? This is a huge problem. It’s the same with Twitter/X or Reddit, not enough people switch away from those, even though it’s easy to do nowadays. Even after so much negative press lately most still stick around. It’s so hard to get the general population moving to something better once they’ve kind of stuck with one thing already. But thankfully, at least on Windows, the process of “enshittification” (forced spyware, bloatware, adware, cloud integrations, MS accounts) continues at a fast pace, which means many users won’t need to be convinced to use Linux, but rather they will at some point be annoyed by Windows/Microsoft itself. Linux becoming easier to use and Windows becoming more annoying and user-hostile at the same time will thankfully accelerate the “organic” Linux growth process, but it’ll still take a couple of years.

  1. “Peer pressure” / feeling of being left alone

As a desktop Linux user, chances are high that you’re an “outsider” among your peers who probably use Windows. Not everyone can feel comfortable in such a role over a longer period of time. Just a matter of market share, again, but still can pose a psychological issue maybe in some cases. Or it can lead to peer pressure, like when some Windows game or something isn’t working fully for the Linux guy, that there will be peer pressure to move to Windows just to get that one working. As one example.

  1. Following the hype of new software releases and thinking that you always need the most features or that you need the “industry standard” when you don’t really need it.

A lot of users probably prefer something like MS Office with its massive feature set and “industry standard” label over the libre/free office suites. Because something that has less features could be interpreted as being worse. But here it’s important to educate such users that it really only matters whether all features they NEED are present. And if so, it wouldn’t matter for them which they use. MS Office for example has a multi-year lead in development (it was already dominating the office suite market world-wide when Linux was still being born so to say) so of course it has more features accumulated over this long time, but most users actually don’t need them. Sure, everyone uses a different subset of features, but it’s at least likely that the libre office suites contain everything most users need. So it’s just about getting used to them. Which is also hard, to make a switch, to change your workflows, etc., so it would be better if MS Office could work on Linux so that people could at least be able to continue to use that even though it’s not recommended to do so (proprietary, spyware, MS cloud integrations). But since I’m all for having more options, it would at least be better in general for it to be available as well. But until that happens, we need to tell potential new users that they probably can also live with the alternatives just fine.

joel_feila ,
@joel_feila@lemmy.world avatar

Well lets look at what i did to switch to linux. It was about 2 years ago and I was still using windows 8 since I didn’t all the spyware in my operating system. I went with linux mint first since it was stated to be super new user friendly. I was so new to linux that I had to ask what neofetch was and how to use it. It was easy to use but I mostly just use web browser, steam, and libre office, which I had been useing libre office for years before that. Linux mint made a very frictionless new user experience. But I still needed that motive to move onto to something now. For me that breaking point was windows just having so must spyware in the os. Rather then using windows 10 or 11 I held onto window to windows 8 and then moved onto linux mint.

Synthead ,

I’ll challenge your point with an analogous question:

Why can’t everybody speak French?

TheButtonJustSpins ,

Because you have to know a bunch of extra letters to make basic sounds.

Underwaterbob ,

I started using Ubuntu at work with version 18.00. It worked without a hitch. Then, it updated to 20.00, and printing broke. I tried multiple “solutions” and none of them worked for my case. For literal years, I had to go to the front desk and print my shit there on the Mac which always printed without issue. Thankfully, in my case I don’t print that much so it wasn’t a huge problem, but I know for some that would be a complete deal breaker.

Cue version 22.00, and printing works again, albeit not always. My jobs get canceled periodically for no reason I can ascertain.

I had similar issues back in the mid-00s with a laptop I was trying to run Ubuntu 6.00 on. It mostly worked, but the webcam and trackpad were a lost cause to someone of my moderate abilities.

It’s shit like this that hold Linux back. I’ve been running some form of Windows since 95, and I’ve never had unsolvable hardware problems with it.

ocassionallyaduck ,

I’m a lifelong windows power user, and above average even in my industry for knowledge on technical expertise.

Nothing I know translates to Linux. Not the file structures, the commands, the permissions, the file systems.

You truly have to commit to learning an entirely parallel form of computing environment to become comfortable in Linux. And being frank, it is the most customizable and unique user experience out there, but it is also infinitely less user friendly. And for every time a 2 line terminal command fixes a problem and saves time compared with windows, there are dozens of instances where time is wasted for hours learning that command, its exact syntax and usage, and if it is the one you need for your circumstance.

Another user here recently said that it was when they were going through and compiling their own drivers to make their Webcam work and having to follow guides to make system specific tweaks that they just quit and went back to Windows for ease of use.

Linux is the OS of power users. Not even power users like me, but extreme power users who either have the time or training to learn that parallel system. All of which is easy if this is your job, but in many ways you are learning a second language of sorts.

squaresinger ,

I think you are right, but I also think it’s a bit more in the relearning side than on the “Linux is hard” side.

I also spent most of my time working on Windows. When I started to work with Linux, like the OP I spent many years with in the “use it until I mess something up and then reinstall because I can’t fix it” loop. But after a few years I really got into it. I haven’t done a misconfiguration related reinstall in many years.

But if you put me in front of a Mac, I wouldn’t even know how to copy/paste text.

megane_kun ,
@megane_kun@lemm.ee avatar

But if you put me in front of a Mac, I wouldn’t even know how to copy/paste text.

I’ve had to troubleshoot router problems for a neighbor who uses Mac, and man was it a confusing experience. The UX is obviously Mac, so I’ve had trouble with it. But when I got to the command-line, it almost broke me. Why I was even in the command-line in the first place? I don’t even know! But it’s a confusing mix of familiar (from daily-driving Linux), and unfamiliar (different Mac-specific commands and syntax).

Someone else could probably point out what I’ve done wrong, but it still doesn’t make it not a confusing experience. It’s humbling, and the kids who’ve hung around me watching me try to fix their computer were even giving me tips (mostly on how to navigate the UI, helping me where to find the settings, etc).

squaresinger ,

Yeah, goes to show that one doesn’t know/learn “computers” but OS specific stuff.

I don’t know “computers”, I know Windows and Debian-like Linux.

cyberian_khatru ,
@cyberian_khatru@kbin.social avatar

yup, this hits the nail on the head for me. I consider myself very tech literate; I am my family's IT guy. I even have Mint installed in a separate drive but I seldom use it unless I have nothing else to do for an afternoon. And the reason is that the more I know about windows (be it editing the registry, troubleshooting services, learning diagnostics tools...) the less comparatively capable I feel in a linux environment. It's like moving countries after I spent my whole life learning this city and I could't even speak my native language anymore. Yeah I know it works out of the box and there's wine and I can make my UX the same. But, going back to my metaphor, that feels like moving to a different country and just not leaving my house and only talking to the people I knew back home. Yeah it would be the same if I severely constrict my comfort zone. You just have to learn a bunch of new shit and leave all you know behind and that's just one distro. Because YEAH linux isn't an OS it's a whole family of operating systems. The nerd yelling that it's a kernel is right in the worst way possible. I can learn Mint but I can form an opinion on Linux because I still wouldn't know shit about Arch or Fedora or Gentoo or what-have-you. It's all very daunting and what I have is functional. No, not "functional enough". This does literally everything I want in less than 4 clicks, everything is plug-and-play, everything works out of the box (and if it doesn't you're sure as shit it wouldn't work out of the box on linux), my knowledge on windows is applicable on every machine I find, it's the system everyone expects me to have (I'm fucking sure the software my uni made me install for online tests wouldn't have a Linux installer). It's not just that the path of least resistance points to mac/windows, Linux as a whole also has very potent repelling field. I still want to learn it but not because I see any practical value/utility in it.

PseudoSpock ,

Pretty simple, really. Buy a console for gaming, or a separate machine for gaming. I don’t game, the joy of that died with the loss of lan parties and Tribes II.

Choose a system, make it your daily driver for work and home, and you will form the habits and muscle memory. Don’t and it will remain a struggle to some degree or another.

bankimu ,

I’m not sure why you say that. I’ve been using Arch to play triple A games (Control, Diablo 4, Elden Ring, Death Stranding, etc.) with NVidia GPU even (which is known to have proprietary driver and not as tweakable). Never had a single glitch, everything runs like native.

PseudoSpock ,

My experimentation with gaming using Steam had gone just fine, as well. But I hear it all the time, that Linux and gaming have issues. My response to them is pretty much that I don’t care. I don’t use Linux for gaming. Gaming isn’t my thing. To me, gamers and their needs are completely unimportant, as the pass time is just a waste.

h14h ,

Most of the comments here are talking about the x% of time Linux gets messed up it can be really intimidating for new users and getting the right help can be a challenge, or simply more time than it’s worth.

I think this is true, but I think there’s another thing that irks people:

Software Compatibility

The general public primarily interacts with their computers through established applications that commonly aren’t available on Linux w/o intimidating work around (if at all).

A noob who switches to Linux isn’t going to know the limitations up front, and the second they decide they want to learn Adobe Premier for work, they’re kinda fucked. They’ll either spend hours/days of online research trying to figure out if it’s even possible, or they’ll ask for help only to have someone tell them they’re wrong for trying and to use some FOSS alternative because Adobe is an evil megacorp.

It’s a recipe for frustration.

squaresinger ,

The last part is a real issue. You can pretty much guarantee, that whenever you ask for help/talk about issues with Linux anywhere online, some helpful Linux zealot will be there to tell you what an idiot you are for having issues with Linux. Most of the time, these guys have been running Ubuntu off a Life USB stick for a week or two so far.

megane_kun ,
@megane_kun@lemm.ee avatar

That last part is my experience when I tried installing a “non-supported printer” for my computer. I wanted to hook up into a computer my brother bought, and ended up in the printer model’s manufacturer’s page and having to choose between an Ubuntu driver and a Debian one. I use neither.

I eventually found my way to the AUR repository (because btw, I used Manjaro at the time—go figure what’s wrong in this scenario, lol!) and even ended up on some random repos for similar models. There were a lot of conflicting advice: like using a driver for a similar printer, or making my own package for my printer model.

I ended up deciding that I somehow have to make a package for my printer model, and having asked around for advice on how to do this, I was met with “why even brother with that printer brand?!” And I was like, “because that’s what’s available to me! And I don’t have enough money to buy a different one! I just want this to work!!”

TheQuantumPhysicist ,

The Linux community doesn’t understand what “just works” really means.

Whether windows or mac, I plug my machine to the docking station, and it just works.

With Linux, every day a different problem. Out of the blue, screens just stop working. Resolutions change. Every restart different behavior. Zero consistency.

I’m not 17 anymore… I don’t have the time to keep tweaking. I need to be productive.

So what do I do? I SSH to a Linux machine whose desktop environment I don’t wanna see, and code remotely. Most productive setting.

You asked. Here’s the answer.

RassilonianLegate ,
@RassilonianLegate@mstdn.social avatar

@TheQuantumPhysicist
@leninmummy
This is another one of those things I've heard about but not experienced, I use my computer every day and haven't had any issues in over a year at this point

squaresinger ,

Well, bugs don’t spread evenly. Depending on your hardware, the software you run and your use cases, you might have no issues or really bad issues.

BOB_DROP_TABLES ,

Try using screens with different resolutions at the same time. Always gave me trouble. In my case was always using a horizontal one and a vertical one together. I’ve had framerate problems, tearing, artefacts (parts of the vertical screen wouldn’t update while the other 2 worked fine). From time to time, X will forget my monitor configuration too after a reboot / unplugging the dock / waking from sleep. All that with 2 laptops from different brands using different docstations, one with XFCE on Ubuntu and the other with KDE on Arch. I got it mostly working, but it’s still troublesome

rocketeer8015 ,

That 40 year old X protocol might be the issue here, use wayland for multi monitor with different resolutions.

BOB_DROP_TABLES ,

Yup, I suspect that is indeed the issue. Haven’t tried KDE in wayland yet as I’ve seen some people saying it’s still a bit rough. Will give it a try anyway. May give sway another shot too

joel_feila ,
@joel_feila@lemmy.world avatar

you hit the nail on the head. When I first got into linux I was watching some youtube video about I think the pine phone and the person basically came to the realization, and you can see the sadness on his face, that people want their computer to work like an kitchen appliance. Plug it in, press button, it does it thing. No need to learn about how it works.

joey ,

@deleted

I guess they’re linking the same repo. However they talk about their positive experience with linux on surface pro

https://lemm.ee/post/1451648

Edit: someone mentioned that nobara has the patches incorporated in their release. Might be worth checking out

deleted ,

I installed linux-surface from github and gnome 43. everything now works.

joey ,

Glad you got it working!

tehcpengsiudai ,

Because clicking a button, finding out it works sometimes but not for you, then the top 3 google links might have a solution to parts of your problem, and you’ll have to type in commands to run stuff you probably ran less than 20 times in your entire lifetime, kinda sucks. Even if you try to learn what actually went on, you’d need to do mental gymnastics.

Having multiple buttons to click and have what you want done almost all the time is much easier in comparison.

Source: was once a beginner, although it does get easier.

Zagone ,

Exactly. There are 3 to 10 solutions to every problem – all of which worked for someone, 0 to 4 of which will work for you. Spend two hours, then role the dice and see if you got lucky.

If it did NOT work, was it stupid user error, wrong or incomplete directions, malfunctional software, or randomness in your particular unique machine configuration?

Or – if you use Oracle’s free VPS – was it an undocumented incompatibility between the code and the unusual chipset they sometimes offer?

PseudoSpock ,

It’s called learning. Try it sometime.

meat_popsicle ,

You should think that to yourself next time you ask for support or help with anything. Fix it yourself - it’s called learning. Try it sometime.

PseudoSpock ,

No different then a good bug report. Try something, if it doesn’t work, research why. If after you’ve researched and tried everything you can, then present your case to others. By that point you can show what things you’ve tried and didn’t work, and what sources/references you used.

denissimo ,
@denissimo@feddit.de avatar

This is like asking why manual or automatic is frustrating. You mostly use the thing you have grown up with and that’s it, particularly when you got bills to pay and there isn’t much free time unfortunately. If you put it into perspective, a massive amount of users already hold Linux in their hands and everyday life: Android. Nah let’s get back to computers.

IT class back in college taught a wee bit of Linux. I was one of the few who were interested and did what the teacher said, the rest played Hearthstone. Linux Mint is what intrigued me since high school. A wonderful OS that brings life to laptops too slow for Windows 7. But I’m still the cozy and unbothered person who sticks to Windows on their main machine. I just want to relax after a good days work and play Forza Horizon 5. However I do enjoy my Linux laptops that won’t run red hot just because of Windows Update, Defender, telemetry and other garbage. My love&hate about Linux is that there are so many distros to choose from. There were times when x is better than y and it was(still is) the devils circle: distro hopping. Today I’m cool with Ubuntu derivatives like Mint and Pop, along with Fedora and Suse, since a decade of having at least one Linux PC I still don’t find joy in advanced stuff like Arch. Anyway use the thing you are comfy with and don’t let anyone judge you, live your life. <3

Ew0 ,

Some of us like it to work, some of us like to make it work :)

squaresinger ,

The zoo of system software on Linux is a real issue.

For Windows, if you are the local family admin, if someone asks you how to solve some issue, there are only two possible (and quite similar) options (Win10 and 11). You can either point them to the right location in the settings if you know it by heart, or you just fire up your PC and tell them each step.

If it’s Linux, you first start with the question “What distro are you using?” and then they answer something you maybe have never heard.

JackbyDev ,

Using it since I was 12

People have been using X since that age so anything different is going to be jarring. Just the smallest roadblocks can put people off of stuff. Why bother learning something new when the old thing works?

PseudoSpock ,

Because learning is a good thing.

JackbyDev ,

Sure, but people don’t just randomly decide to learn something unless they want to learn it or they think it is useful. I can’t drive a manual transmission car. Car enthusiasts may explain to me while they’re blue in the face why they’re better but unless I actually want to do it I want do it even though “learning” is a good thing inherently. That’s how folks who don’t understand Linux view it. The goodness of “learning” is not enough to get them to want to do it.

PseudoSpock ,

Not wanting to learn is just boring and lazy.

JackbyDev ,

There’s a difference between not wanting to learn anything and not wanting to learn a new operating system.

PseudoSpock ,

That’s a very boomer like attitude. Learn or get left behind.

JackbyDev ,

Go learn why they don’t want to learn some incredibly niche OS then.

PseudoSpock ,

Niche, huh? Linux dang near runs the world. Not being a primary gaming platform does not make it niche.

BaumGeist ,

Why bother learning something new when the old thing works?

When I was younger, I would have read this and agreed: people are resistent to change, and that holds us back.

Now, I read this and agree: why do we worry so much about having the newest and shiniest when what we have still works? Seems like a waste of time and resources

monobot ,

Most people stop trying anything technical as soon as it does not work as they expected.

As soon as something unexpected happens or something expected doesn’t happen, they drop it.

While Windows is like that for me and my needs, for them it is Linux.

PseudoSpock ,

That’s a flaw with the people, not the OS.

monobot ,

Don’t think like that. People are people, they will not change. Accept them and yourself.

PseudoSpock ,

Oof, no. Some people are people. Have you met people? Do not recommend.

Obi ,
@Obi@sopuli.xyz avatar

I just don’t care that much about my OS as long as it runs the programs I need it to run, which windows does and Linux doesn’t.

josephsh98 , (edited )

Some things just don’t work properly on Linux without doing a lot of tinkering, while on Windows doing the same particular thing works effortlessly. For example, if you want to have an overlay that shows performance stats such as FPS, CPU Temp, CPU Utilization,etc…, while playing a video game, on Windows you can just run MSI Afterburner, simple as that. On Linux, there this tool called Mangohud, while it’s a great tool, it doesn’t come with a GUI (of course it doesn’t, many Linux developers are GUI-phobic for some reason.) So, you either have to do a lot of tinkering with configuration files to get it work and then run it from the terminal, or you use another program called GOverlay, which is a graphical program that utilizes Mangohud among other tools. But guess what? It’s broken at the moment, the thing just outright refuses to work properly, so you’re stuck with using configuring Mangohud on your own! This is just one example of the many things that are frustrating on Linux but are otherwise convenient on Windows.

bankimu ,

I hate GUI for every little thing. Config files are so much more flexible, shareable, and use friendly because you can edit them with anything and can have much more control.

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