I hope someday we'll find a way to pirated a car ( lemmy.world )

In the end, the KIA car company made its cars into subscription models, I really hate this because in the end the car we buy with our own money doesn't feel like it belongs to us.
Should we finally buy an old school car ? so as not to be affected by this subscription models or is there a way to crack the software installed in it ?

DivisionResult ,

Yall taking about modern cars, meanwhile my 94' Citröen works like a charm. Aftermarket alarm with GPS unmbolizer for 50 bucks does al the work.

https://piped.video/watch?v=aTNAghGMnIU

This is freedom hahahaha

DivisionResult ,

It even hasn't a ECU. Lol

Outtatime ,
@Outtatime@sh.itjust.works avatar

Game console manufacturing companies used to use people for modding a console that the person owned fair and square. And they won.

Hootz ,

I miss when you didn't need a cell connection for remote start, like my fob can lock and unlock my car from the third floor of my building why can't I just have a button on my remote that does the same as unlocking my doors.

Although, the roadside kinda makes $60 a year worth it just for the peace of mind, gotta atleast give em that.

xbit00 ,

My 22 civic remote starts from the fob. So they are still out there.

Pounddc1 ,

HMU on telegram if you got verified Id.me let hit $100k upwards and split @pounddc1

Pounddc1 ,

HMU on telegram if you got verified Id.me let hit $100k upwards and split @pounddc1

pete_the_cat ,

Kia's just suck in general AFAIK. My friend has a 2010 Kia Sorento and he has some "device" on top of the positive (?) terminal of his battery. The terminal ring is a bit loose so it doesn't make proper contact with the battery terminal and he has to hold it against it so that he can start his car.

I thought he was bullshitting me at first because he's not a car guy and told me before that when his car was fucking up that it was the transmission, but it was the coil packs. Nope, there's a big black box on the top of the battery and he said that only Kia can service it, and it'll cost like $800 to fix.

AdolfSchmitler ,

For $120 a year the Kia boys can total your car anyway!

Crashumbc ,

While I'm generally against subscriptions, for the most part the above are things that require cellular service and cloud infrastructure...

While the price may be too high. I'm normally ok with subscriptions for things that have on-going costs to the seller.

saintshenanigans ,

Yeah I would need to see the "read more" here, all of these look fine but I'd never be surprised to see shit like cruise control or heated seats pop up on a paywall.

CileTheSane ,
@CileTheSane@lemmy.ca avatar

My car has remote lock and unlock on a FOB, no reason for an app and subscription.
I also get the feeling that the diagnostics are done on board by the car, it's just refusing to give you the information unless you're paying the sub.

Skates ,

I work on crap like this, and it depends. Yeah, diagnostics are done in the car - the main ones, that is. But for example BMW collects data from all their cars - they're able to do some big data analysis. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the diagnostic info this app provided is an inference - your car has software version 4.3.21, and all cars on that sw version have experienced a certain bug at 200k km, so it's time to go to the dealership or get a remote update or something. It could be done.

Most likely though, they're just taking the personal data from your car and showing it to you. You know - after also saving it for themselves.

PriorityMotif ,
@PriorityMotif@lemmy.world avatar

Put a knockoff air tag in your car and half of this is solved for $10.

Crashumbc ,

Literally one item on that list could be solved with a airtag. And airtags start at 30, even the knockoffs are 20 and don't really work well.

artic ,

We should be able to self host the servers and choose the cellular service like i can on my phone then

DTFpanda ,

I really hope my '01 4Runner lasts forever

Varixable ,

Got an 02 still going strong that I'm delusional enough to hope lasts another 20 years.

dog_ ,

They also made them easy to steal!

ad_on_is ,
@ad_on_is@lemmy.world avatar

or.. we just need more FOSS alternatives to the car manufacturers proprietary OS.

I already see GH issues like: "breaks stop working when going above 200mph."

CCF_100 , 
if (vehicle.getSpeed() >= 200) {
    vehicle.respondToBrakes = false;
}
shootwhatsmyname ,
@shootwhatsmyname@lemm.ee avatar 
if (vehicle.getSpeed() % 2 === 1) {
    vehicle.useFreedomEagleUnits = true
} else {
    vehicle.useFreedomEagleUnits = false
}
CCF_100 ,

😂

WeLoveCastingSpellz ,

I will do you one better: open source public transport

JasonDJ ,

More than likely the brakes would break at 129Mph, as your car is now going -32768Mph.

Allero ,

Bot manh will risk installing unofficial software on their car.

We should heavily regulate official options.

AProfessional ,

Cars separate core functionality from the infotainment system. I’d fully expect foss infotainment to be significantly higher quality.

Allero ,

Cars often don't now, rendering you unable to start/open them.

Also, define "higher quality". More user-centric, less obtrusive and "just works"? Yes, certainly better in that regard.

skyspydude1 ,

I can tell you working at an OEM we see far crazier notes like this coming in

Madison420 ,

Brakes, if your brakes break you break.

CaptainProton ,

Directed or viper smart-start.... Same thing but $60 a year, and can be retrofitted into some really old cars.

Problem is with the increasingly non-standardized designs, it's just not realistic to build a module for every car that's out there.

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

Should we finally buy an

Who is we?
Why are you buying a car in the first place?
get as many of the negatives of car ownership away from you.
I lease my Taycan. I do not want to pay for tyres or checkups. I do not want to pay in case the engine blows (not that it can, it's electric but you get the gist).

EvokerKing ,

Even electric engines can still break and have issues

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

Yeah but i don't have to worry about that because anything but negligence is of no interest to me and included in the lease.

Rednax ,

For some, this subscription model is great. But do you agree, that is it a bad thing if they force it on us?

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

I don't understand buying a car unless it is a shitbox for the track and putting a rollcage in.

Rednax ,

I don't understand why someone would want to rent their car. Maintenance is not that hard, and companies always make you pay way more for their subscription models. By owning the car, you can pick who does maintenance. Meaning there can be competition, so prices/quality remains good.

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

LMAO you want to switch your Battery yourself? And pay for it directly? And if something goes wrong pay even more? Firgure out what shop has fair prices and doesnt fuck you over?
No thanks, i'd rather have all my services included in my lease.

GiveMemes ,

Dude you're paying a mortgage payment to not even own a car. Pardon me if I don't take your financial advice. Glad you're doing well for yourself, but most people aren't able to afford a Porsche.

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

It doesn't have to be the car i drive. Cars have enormous loss of value. I'd rather have a new car every 3 of 5 Years and pay rent on it, than to have a car that i pay the same amount of money but i can trash it 10 years later or spend as much as a new car to keep it pristine.

corship ,

This type of subscription is actually kiiiiinda understandable because the company has to maintain servers, staff and keep the software secure because they're handling sensitive data such as location etc.

I also remember that BMW I think? Had a heated seat subscription and that's really not justifiable imo

HUMAN_TRASH ,

Totally agreed, it would be nice if you could set it up yourself but that'll never happen. Even if you did set it up yourself it wouldn't be free though

Paddzr ,

Qne is this not already part of the purchase? Cars like everything else went up in price. Labour and raw materials cost more. But not even for a second am i under an illusion they're not baking the upkeep of servers and updates as part of the cost with a hefty margin.

limelight79 ,

Yeah for connected features, there are those costs. A vehicle we own would let me remote start it and lock and unlock doors from the app...if I paid $15/month. It's not worth it to me, so I've never paid for that service, and the vehicle works fine without it. I mostly even forget it exists. I might be more interested if it would report things like fuel level, oil and fuel filter replacement time, and so on, but it doesn't (but even then I'm not sure it'd be worth $15/month).

A subscription for heated seats, though? No. I don't want a subscription service for something that doesn't have an ongoing cost to the manufacturer. For us in particular, we buy our cars with the intention of keeping them a long time, and I'm not paying that fee for the life of the car. I like cars that are paid off.

If I'm on a heated seat subscription and they break for some reason, who pays for them to be fixed?

Comparison on the heated seats repair question: I rent the water softener at my house for $29/month. (The previous owner set it up, and I haven't gotten around to replacing it...it's a "it's working, and I have bigger issues" situation.) At this point I've paid for two of the highest-end home water softeners available, and I haven't had a single issue with the one I have, so it's definitely not the best setup financially. But, if my water softener dies today, I can call them, and they'll come right out and fix it or replace it, no charge. So there is a benefit to that monthly subscription price; they take the risk of it failing, not me.

SamBBMe ,

I had a 2023 Elantra, and iirc it had these features for $30 a year after my subscription ended.

These prices are way higher. Seems like every company agreed that subscription = $10(ish) a month, regardless of the actual cost the features justify.

Nobody ,

You wouldn’t download [the basic features of an item you already purchased.]

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

How is unlocking your car over the internet a basic feature?

unrelatedkeg ,

Your oxygen subscription expires in 2 weeks. Please take note that absence of oxygen leads to hypoxia. Due to the detrimental effects of the war in Ukraine we have been forced to increase prices by 420%. Would you like to extend your subscription?

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

How is that related to unlocking your car from your phone?

Evia ,
@Evia@lemmy.world avatar

Because the cost of the app to do that isn't $60 a year.

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

No the cost of the Servers and the maintenance and the work required to have all that kept online and secure is.
Do you think admins and security guys work for free?

Evia ,
@Evia@lemmy.world avatar

I'll refer you to unexpctedkeg's comment

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

will refer to my already posted answer to that comment

unrelatedkeg ,

Both are, or at least should be, ridiculous.

Yes, an app costs money. Yes, servers do cost money. But do they need to use servers? No. For example, self-hosting. Or just connecting the car to the cellular network (which they already do, mind you) and just let the phone talk to it directly, no manufacturer server required. Just pay an ISP for cell service and you're set. Are there problems with such a solution security-wise? Yes. And while I'm not an expert in cybersecurity I think the risks are about the same for this and a server model.

Hell, they might not even use servers for anything other than checking if you've paid your subscription in order to lower costs already (as if a few thousand unlock requests a minute couldn't be managed without a problem on a Raspberry Pi). They don't need some huge, expensive and power-hungr supercomputer for that, so I don't see a need for such a steep price.

Are the features useful? Absolutely. Would someone be willing to pay this price? Also absolutely. But the festures objectively don't cost that much to maintain and competition should and could put an end to it.

It's just corporate greed, and it feels to me as if we're getting closer and closer to the fabled oxygen subscription, and we have to call manufacturers out on their bullshit while we still have air to breathe.

Just don't buy their cars or at least their subscriptions. Get your car 'jailbreaked'. What will they do, remote disable it? I think we're still not that far down the dystopia plotline that a boycott couldn't work.

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

You want to selfhost your own server that communicates with your car so you can ulock your car from your phone? Are you dumb? Do you want to lose your car in a week?
Delusional.

unrelatedkeg ,

[Thread, post or comment was deleted by the author]

    •
    Nobsi ,
    @Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

    Then *** don't buy the subscription ***
    It is very easy. the design is very human.

    CileTheSane ,
    @CileTheSane@lemmy.ca avatar

    Why do I need to unlock my car over the internet? What is the use case over a FOB?

    Nobsi ,
    @Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

    Nice strawman.
    Dont get the subscription if youre fine with a fob.

    CileTheSane ,
    @CileTheSane@lemmy.ca avatar

    How is asking you a follow-up question a strawman exactly? What do you think a strawman is?

    Nobsi ,
    @Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

    Because the question was answered in my original question. You don't. That's why it's an additional subscription feature.
    My question was why the guy claimed it was a basic feature when it never was.
    And then you came along and asked "well hurr durr why do i need to unlock my car from my phone"
    You don't. So you don't need the subscription. Done.

    CileTheSane ,
    @CileTheSane@lemmy.ca avatar

    That’s why it’s an additional subscription feature.

    So why is it worth a subscription? You're defending it as something that is not a basic feature that validates the subscription, but asking what the feature actually provides is somehow a strawman?

    Nobsi ,
    @Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

    Oh you were seriously asking? It allows me to unlock the car from my couch when my wife wants to get something out the car real quick. Or i don't wanna carry my keys around.
    I can also start the A/C 30 minutes before i leave so i dont have to freeze to death in winter.

    CileTheSane ,
    @CileTheSane@lemmy.ca avatar

    I don't know what makes you think I wasn't asking, and I still don't understand what you think a strawman is, but thank you for actually answering the question.

    Personally I can think of better uses for $150 a year then "I don't like having keys in my pocket/near the door" but I guess there's a reason we keep seeing more companies trying to profit off subscriptions...

    Nobsi ,
    @Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

    It's a basic convenience/status in exchange for money.
    You wanna control your house from your phone? Sure, pay me for the effort of keeping all that shit secure.
    I like convenience, that's why i eat out 6 days a week.

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